So what if 'Idol' picks semi-pros?

Posted: Monday, February 09, 2009 6:00 AM by Gael Fashingbauer Cooper
Filed Under: TV

There's been a lot of uproar about "American Idol" picking singers who've already had some major musical experience. First, the fuss was over Joanna Pacitti, who was recognized by judge Kara DioGuardi for her previous record deal.

Reuters

"American Idol's" first winner, Kelly Clarkson, had tried for an L.A. music career before she made it on the show.

But Pacitti is only one of many wannabe "Idols" this year who've already felt the heat of the spotlight. There's an Osmond, a Miss New York USA, a "Sopranos" actress, an actor from "Wicked," Jonny Lang's sister, and more.

It's hard to blame the producers. If they're really supposedly looking for someone to sign to a record contract, it helps to have some singers who've proven they have the discipline to sing in a musical or work on a record, even if they don't manage to make it big.

You can't blame the singers, either. If show rules say you're eligible as long as you don't have a current record contract, hey, you're eligible. Who can blame them for going after the golden ring?

I know why some viewers are upset. There's a myth that "American Idol" is plucking complete novices out of bad situations (Kellie Pickler's dad was in jail while she was on the show) and gives them that one magic chance. But that's a myth that both the show's history and its own rules do not support (Kelly Clarkson and David Archuleta are just two past "Idol" successes who came with experience already.)

My friend Mike, the former sportswriter, points out that there are no minor leagues in music. So those singers who've had record contracts or recorded with a band or sung their hearts out on Broadway, but are still unknowns ... they're trying to climb the ladder of their chosen career as best they can. If "Idol" picks them and they succeed, more power to them. I'm less irritated by the good singers with experience than I am the fact that "Idol's" producers still think it's funny to send bad singers to perform before the judges, knowing they'll only be mocked.

Should "Idol" have a "no previous record contracts ever" rule? Can you get behind a singer who's already had his or her first shot at the spotlight? And if not, why not?

EMAIL THIS

Comments

Ah! THANK YOU! This is pretty much exactly how I feel. I mean yes, it would be nice to pick unknowns, but if I haven't heard of them, they're still unknown to me, and still deserve a chance. Some of them are REALLY talented, but just haven't found a national spotlight yet, and this show can give that to them. More power to them.

Heather, Tampa, FL (Sent Monday, February 09, 2009 9:59 AM)

Frankly, I'd rather the "no previous record contracts ever" rule. It's nice to be able to cheer for a person who just happens to be in the right spot at the right time. Someone who is totally undiscovered.

Robin, Las Vegas NV (Sent Monday, February 09, 2009 10:25 AM)

I feel it does not matter if a contestant previously had a record contract. For whatever reason, it did not work out. If contestant competes for Idol, it shows that they still have the drive and passion to pursue their dreams. Ultimately, isn't that what the show promotes? Just because one avenue did not yield results, doesn't mean that one shouldn't be allowed to try another. In the end, we're still cheering for the one with superior talent to win.

Kelly Dumas (Sent Monday, February 09, 2009 10:47 AM)

I just think people should get over this. AI is about discovering unknown talented singers. As long as they are unisgned at the moment of the auditions, it's fine! Just think about it: "to be eligible the contestants should have no previous experience at all". Imagine the flood of "William Hungs" and the lack of "Kelly Clarksons" in the show. That'd be a disaster.

Chris, Toronto, ON (Sent Monday, February 09, 2009 10:48 AM)

I believe in second chances and third chances. Almost all the Idol auditioners, or a good portion of them, have had some type of experience on stage or in the recording booth. They've been there done that. Look at that youngster Josiah Lemming who had NO experience outside his bedroom, and he nearly cracked under the tension. And where is he now? I would prefer someone who played the local bars and local state fairs and was marginally good and listenable, who's been in the music environment and can withstand all the "drama".

All they want is to be seen a second time. The problem is this: Idol needs to become it's own recording label and booking agency and maybe even open up an "Idol" club(s). They are graduating so many Idols every year and some of them make it a living and some of them don't.

Sally in Chicago (Sent Monday, February 09, 2009 10:51 AM)

in theory that is how I feel but I think that record companies, and people in the business might start to get behind people and influence the show towards a certain person, that JOanna pacitti has uncomfortable close ties to sony bmg already

mfields (Sent Monday, February 09, 2009 11:03 AM)

My bottom line is that I want to see talented people succeed. I don't know if I can handle another Sanjaya season. Being a successful and talented musician means that one needs to put time into his/her craft. The more time on stage, time in a recording booth, or time in a practice room is going to result in a more talented entertainer for the American public to enjoy.

Kristy B, Reading, PA (Sent Monday, February 09, 2009 11:19 AM)

It seems to be a simple issue of chance to me. If someone has had a previous record contract then they had a chance already given to them and they already failed. These are people that are obviously talented but were not well received by the public.

Ryan Humphrey, Elkhart, Indiana (Sent Monday, February 09, 2009 11:52 AM)

There is a big difference betweena semi-pro and
someone who has direct ties to the show.
It has already been reported that Joanna Pacitti
has close ties with 19 Entertainment.
And that's ok with you?
And what about David Osmond?
His aunt Marie worked for Simon Cowell
on his show Celebrity Duets. Remember that show?

Check it out for yourself.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Celebrity_Duets

And that's ok with you?

I know a lot of people are going to say that
David Osmond got cut..
True, but let's not forget that American Idol
is bringing back the wild card this year.
Gee, I wonder who it will be? David Osmond?

It maybe ok for some people, but what about all
the people that took time from their daily
lives just to try out?

I wonder how they feel about it and do you even care?
If you would like more infomation.

http://americanidolexposed.wordpress.com/

What American Idol is doing is the old bait and switch

Please America OPEN YOUR EYES.........

Nostradamus, South Of France (Sent Monday, February 09, 2009 12:36 PM)

Wow. Someone's on the Idol payroll. The show goes to great lengths to make us believe the contestants are true undiscovered talents. But if some are actually losers, already been rejected by us the public, why are producers allowing them onto the show? I do not believe the talent pool is that shallow. The fix is in.

Randy, Windsor, ON (Sent Monday, February 09, 2009 1:09 PM)

I have thought that American Idol is fixed and has been from the begining. I dislike the fact that there are so many of this seasons contestants who have connections to people who have connections to Idol. American Idol is just like wrestling..both are fake. The show fills the "talent" line up with cannon fodder(the ones with out screen time so no one knows who they are) while the chosen plants, due to their connections get further in the show due the judges pimping them with undeserved praise.

I.M.Vexed, my, livingroom (Sent Monday, February 09, 2009 3:01 PM)

I personally think, if someone has had a previous experience (record deal, Broadway, competition, etc.), it shows that they are serious about the business. Where would we all be if we only got one chance at everything we did? There are second chances in the music industry, with or without Idol. You can't expect your first shot at fame to work out. It doesn't, for most.

That being said, I think there is a line that needs to be drawn. In Joanna Pacitti's case, she has had songs on at least two soundtracks from successful movies, released an album on a major label with significant publicity, and Britney Spears covered one of her songs. Since those events are fairly recent, that means she is gradually working her way towards fame in my oppinion. By going on Idol, she is simply taking the easy way out. For me, that's when I have a problem with an experienced contestant.

Victoria, Over the Rainbow, Oz (Sent Monday, February 09, 2009 4:10 PM)

Wow. Nostradamus sure takes this ridiculously seriously!

It's a show designed to make money by entertaining America. It is probably the best at doing what it was designed to do. The fact that a young singer, experienced or otherwise, might go places in the music industry is entirely beside the point (other than the fact that they continue to be a money maker for the producers.)

Who says a person only gets one kick at the can? If I lose my job in my field, does that mean I can never work in my field again? Of course not. So if Joe Schmo's first shot at musical superstardom doesn't pan out, why can't he try, try again? Isn't picking yourself up, dusting yourself off, and looking for the next great opportunity what gets people ahead in this world?

The bottom line is that American Idol doesn't purport to be the everyman singing competition or they would let contestants in via random draw. It's nothing but biased towards what Mr. Cowell thinks we want to hear. And we choose, from his narrowed-down field, the person we like. And that person either goes on to greatness in the recording industry, or doesn't. It's just a show, it's usually fun to watch.

I think the word CHILLAX was coined just for this purpose. And now I'm laughing at myself because I never thought I'd find a use for the word 'chillax'.

Christine, Frederick MD (Sent Monday, February 09, 2009 4:37 PM)

It's not their faults they 'failed' in the past. It was probably the record label/management who failed the artist by not supporting them and promoting them the way they should have. Anyone can be successful with the right promotion and money going their way. I mean look at Taylor Swift, she can't sing for her life but she's a music God now just because her management is shoving her down everyone's throats.

Nicole, Wheeling (Sent Monday, February 09, 2009 4:59 PM)

Why does all this remind me of baseball players who take steroids? You know. Compete against those who don't use steroids and yet have the advantage that comes with administering them to yourself to ensure you win. Previous professional experience provides that advantage. Granting such competitors acknowledgement of their chance to win only perpetuates the dubiousness of such competition.

lighteningdodger (Sent Monday, February 09, 2009 5:40 PM)

I know, as a mere mortal, that my opinion must be taken with a grain of salt, as I am too naive to understand that the music business "has no minor league"; however, there are those who have had five or six chances (e.g. Pacitti), and subsequently failed to make anything out of those chances, and there are those who have had none. To me, and remember I'm no pro so I may be way off base here, the difference is quite clear.

Those people that have had no chances may not necessarily need to be "plucked out of bad situations" (as those of us myth-buying sheep who are dismayed with the finalists no doubt believe tsk tsk aren't we stupid), but they have not one ounce of experience.

Kelly Clarkson is where she is today because she opted out of her contract with American Idol's management. Kelly Clarkson is where she is today because she took her career into her own hands after Idol's team consistently failed her (remember they had her and Justin Guarini make a musical). When she won the show, Kelly Clarkson was given the first (as in ONE) contract she had ever signed, and she made the most out of it.

If Pacitti wins, it'll be the third or fourth. I see a difference, but then again, what do I know?

S, Dayton OH (Sent Monday, February 09, 2009 9:11 PM)

Unfortunately, it's not the prior experience that is the problem. It's the conflict of interest that is created when contestants have prior connections to the producers, judges, or entertainment company.

And when the show doesn't acknowledge the prior connections, it gives an illusion of impropriety. Take Randy:Carly for instance. Did she really warrant the excessive praise that Randy bestowed on her week after week?

The other problem is the number of contestants that the judges actually see. I doubt it exceeds 500 total in a season, which would make for some very long audition days. It should be disappointing to the contestants with talent, to know that a good portion of the auditions will be filled with jokes and bad talent, and then a portion of the remaining slots are filled with preselected contestants. I'm sure David Archuleta didn't have to wait in all of the audition lines. Nor did Jason Castro's brother, but this is how we get a hollywood spot filled with a Jason's brother type, while a Colbie Callait type doesn't even make it to the judges.

So to me, it's not important if the contestants have prior experience or not. It is important whether they have to go through the same process, or if they get special treatment because of their connections. Am I really to believe that Kara was surprised to see Jackie Mendez walk into the audition, and that Kara didn't help her get the audition ahead of time, since she was on Kara's show? It's possible, but suspect.

Carl, Sunnyvale (Sent Tuesday, February 10, 2009 1:37 PM)

Why shouldn't they compete, IF they got through because of their talent, not their connections. At the same time, the problem is that these people can get more attention because of their experiences. It is up to the producers to ensure everybody gets equal attention.

Tara in Virginia (Sent Tuesday, February 10, 2009 2:38 PM)

The music business is not one where people necessarily experience immediate success. It requires a lot of work to make it as a musician or singer. Should a Broadway show ban auditioners if they were previously in another Broadway show?

Steve G. (Sent Tuesday, February 10, 2009 5:52 PM)

This discussion was much more appropriate 12 months ago, but the answer is the same now as it was then: you are right, in general, but the issue isn't the contestant's past, it's the lying and playing favorites that bothers audiences.

Multiple reports suggest that people are called and "invited" to audition and that those people 1.) often have direct or indirect ties to the judges/producers and 2.) don't have to make it through the crowd (some reports suggest that the "special" contestants are provided a dressing room and "help" getting ready). This built in advantage is exacerbated when, if you know the "plants" before watching the show, you notice that some of the judges may make up their minds (to the positive) a bit early when they are already "familiar" with the contestant.

So, this is a large fairness issue that is more difficult to move past than just "they already made a record." But what makes it worse is the way the stories are presented on the show with relatively obvious fabrications (the most famous being Kristi Lee Cook's barrelhorse story), and the tendency of the producers to slide sideways when called on it. Thus, it gives the impression that the show is maybe more unfair and manipulative than it might actually be, because they seem to be hiding things all the time.

Todd, Las Vegas (Sent Tuesday, February 10, 2009 8:46 PM)

Remember, this is Entertainment. Its purpose is to get money from advertisers, and they do that by getting lots of viewers. Anything that adds or keeps viewers is going to happen.

ed (Sent Wednesday, February 11, 2009 12:05 AM)

Who cares? It's JUST a show!

Me in Detroit (Sent Wednesday, February 11, 2009 4:34 AM)

This show is about talent and entertaining the public. I look for a voice and a performer that goes beyond simple talent show levels - singers I would add to my CD collection. I don't mind a 2nd or 3rd chance for folks who can belt out a toon or make your heart feel emotions.

Let them all sing.

Darrel, Spesbach, Germany (Sent Wednesday, February 11, 2009 6:23 AM)

Joanna is definately not an unknown. Toured with Nick Lachey, songs from the movie Bratz and Legally Blonde...and her own CD "This Crazy Life". But you know what? Most people still do not know Joanna, and more power to her for putting herself out there again. Let's face it, AI works for artists who want to make it big. Joanna isn't there quite yet, and maybe this is her last shot. I say go for it. PS- the girl is wildly talented too...

Andrea (Sent Wednesday, February 11, 2009 6:44 PM)

I have nearly stopped watching the show for just this reason. It's boring and contestants who have had previous successes make me feel like I've been had. My favorite contestant in the past several years has been Elliot Yamin, who seemed genuinely humble and was a true undiscovered talent. (I love his voice too.) That definitely created some of the magic. I also liked Jennifer Hudson for this reason, though she had more experience than Elliot. The 'Cinderella' aspect of the show does contribute to its appeal. Someone like Joanna or that tatooed Irish chick from last year were already too connected. It would have been more fun to see what more coaching and support could have done for folks like the guy from last season who worked as a baggage screener at LAX.

Simon's picks for talent fit a canned formula. One of his proteges from the UK, Leona Lewis is about as boring as they come- she has pipes that have no heart and soul behind them. I'd much rather listen to someone with a distinctive voice (Lizz Wright, for example) than another Whitney or Mariah-clone. I have seen Simon shatter the hearts and dreams of some genuinely talented people, and I'm tired of it. They've put some no-talented narcissists on the show just for the shock factor. Zzzzz...When I'm being manipulated, I'd rather take a hike.

Also, I agree with the previous poster who said that Taylor Swift isn't a very good singer. She's like that Aussie hunk from last season (Michael Johns?) prettier on the outside than on talented. Let's just say that when even Paris Hilton can cut a record that the engineers in the studio can make just about anyone sound good!

Karen, Annapolis, MD (Sent Thursday, February 12, 2009 10:30 AM)

There are lots of artist out whom making a lot of money that can not really sing. Best examples: the Simpson sister (Jessica and Ashley) and Britney Spear. Probably if these three wannabes audition to IA. They don’t have a chance at all/or no fake careers.

Jhun Manassas (Sent Thursday, February 12, 2009 2:44 PM)

Some are comparing Joanna's experience to that of other winners and contestants, even Carrie Underwood. Please, if she got a few bucks for singing local establishments, that does not compare to major record deals, Broadway productions, major movie soundtracks, and recent record deals. They need a clear cut monetary number and time period of inactivity. A record deal should have been less than one million and a contract severed more than a year before before the first Idol audition. Otherwise, those who are successful but not as big as they want to be will cut off their contracts just long enough for their Idol stint. Probably, quite soon, Joanna will have her contract back and all this publicity will have helped her. Ridiculous.

Teri, Buffalo, NY (Sent Thursday, February 12, 2009 3:55 PM)

American Idol is crap anyway, I can't believe anyone actually watches that show. What a waste of time!

Richard, Washington DC (Sent Thursday, February 12, 2009 4:13 PM)

I like this discussion a lot. Personally I really liked the author's quoted phrase that there are no minor leagues in music. It's hard to compare the American Idol stage to any other opportunity a young artist will ever have previous deal or not.

If voting is the real concern, I'll grant this is valid. So have contestants disclose all previous "semi-pro" experience so the voters can factor that in and decide if they care. There's no way someone like Joanna Pacitti's "voting block" can be any more than a rounding error once AMERICA starts voting.

Apparently someone like Joanna Pacitti's only mistake was not "waiting for Idol" to come along before being responsible and working on her career. I guess the message is if you want to be an American Idol contestant, you better make sure your not ambitious. Whatever.

Blah.D.Blah (Sent Thursday, February 12, 2009 4:19 PM)

Isn't the most important thing the rules... as they were laid out to the contestants? If the rules said Joanna was eligible, and she put time and effort into getting into the final 36, then how can they cut her after the fact?

Joe Ventola, Denver, CO (Sent Thursday, February 12, 2009 4:29 PM)

AI is a show about talent, supposedly unknown talent,yes there has to be a line drawn between amatuer and professional, but where?If there are close ties to the producers of AI, that would certainly be one, but as in anything, practice makes perfect. I agree with the concept that as long as a competeter does not have a current contract and are relatively unknown let them have at it. I sure enjoy a talented singer, more so if they are semi-pro and are honing there talent as very few have God given, out of the box talent.If a singer has had a measure of success in the past, does that mean they are a star, AN AMERICAN IDOL ALREADY?.Obviously,a Super Star in the arena of say :George Straight , Garth Brooks,Stevie Wonder,Shenia Twain, Jewel- I believe you get the point has made stardom. I believe the AI contestants are aiming for this level of stardom, so AI, I say promote a semi-pro,and as your show would imply,LET AMERICA VIEWING AUDIENCE RATINGS ASSIST STARDOM OF AN INDIVIDUAL COMPETITOR.Let the no current contract rule be the guiding rule as it stands to reason a person who considers oneself a sucessful star already, would not compete with amatuers or would they ????I know I wouldn't.

Edward Abel (Sent Thursday, February 12, 2009 4:53 PM)

SEND A COMMENT

PLEASE READ: All comments must be approved before appearing in the thread; time and space constraints prevent all comments from appearing. We will only approve comments that are directly related to the blog, use appropriate language and are not attacking the comments of others.

Message (please, no HTML tags. Web addresses will be hyperlinked):

Your name, city and state (John Doe, Seattle, Wash.):

Your e-mail address (jdoe@msnbc.com):

Your website (it's okay if you don't have one):

Remember me? (We'll keep it private) Remember me?

TRACKBACKS

Trackbacks are links to weblogs that reference this post. Like comments, trackbacks do not appear until approved by us. The trackback URL for this post is: http://testpattern.msnbc.msn.com/trackback.aspx?PostID=1781352

More Test Pattern

Recent Posts:

Archives:

2006

Categories:

Syndicate This Site

Add Test Pattern to your news reader:

ABOUT TEST PATTERN

So what if 'Idol' picks semi-pros?

Posted: Monday, February 09, 2009 6:00 AM by Gael Fashingbauer Cooper
Filed Under: TV

EMAIL THIS

Comments

SEND A COMMENT

TRACKBACKS

More Test Pattern

Links

Syndicate This Site

MSNBC Weblogs

ABOUT TEST PATTERN

So what if 'Idol' picks semi-pros?

Posted: Monday, February 09, 2009 6:00 AM by Gael Fashingbauer Cooper Filed Under: TV

EMAIL THIS

Comments

SEND A COMMENT

TRACKBACKS

More Test Pattern

Links

Syndicate This Site

MSNBC Weblogs

Posted: Monday, February 09, 2009 6:00 AM by Gael Fashingbauer Cooper
Filed Under: TV